Neil Dudley: Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Pederson’s Farms Podcast. We are so excited you’re here. We appreciate you joining us. And we look forward to sharing these conversations with thought leaders from our industry. They’re going to paint a picture from every perspective, consumer, customer, vendor, employee, and peer, that I think is going to be super valuable and we’re really excited to share. So thanks for tuning in. Remember, don’t tune out and grab life by the bacon.

Everybody, welcome to the Pederson’s Farms Podcast. I’m super excited to share a conversation with this man. His name is Jordan Grahm. He is at thefitboss on Instagram. And simply he is an inspiration. We’re going to talk about some numbers and some kind of things that are pretty wow. To me, that’s all cool, and I don’t want to diminish it in any way. But he is one of the most tenacious humans living. And I want you all to get to know him. And Jordan, welcome to the show. Thank you so much for your time. Let’s talk about where does that tenacity come from? I mean, it’s easy for me to say that; you have to live it. Tell me about that. Tell us about that.

Jordan Grahm: First of all, thank you. So I mean, that’s really kind of you. And thank you for having me on. I’m excited to share a little bit about my story, or a lot of it, with your folks and listeners. And hopefully I can kind of motivate and inspire people just kind of going over what I’ve gone through and kind of what has brought me to where I am today. 

Neil Dudley: I think where I get so impressed, and it’s really with it’s not a truth I’ve lived. Like I’ve never battled real obesity. And I wouldn’t say it’s because I’m some special great person that never has ate bad. I just kind of genetically got blessed in that way. It’s not a thing I’ve had to deal with. So it really impresses me with when I see somebody who’s lost a huge amount of weight, and I know that is a grind. It is a grind the same as dealing with addiction, depression, all of these mental things that you have to deal with, on top of eating better, working out. Did you find any one of those things I mentioned or even something different to be like your crux or your hardest thing to deal with?

Jordan Grahm: I’ve dealt with all the above, shin issues, depression, anxiety, mental stuff, that is still something that I work through. The thing, and I would say comparing it to like drugs or alcohol or something is that we don’t need those things live, survive, but food, when you are addicted to it, you also still have to eat to survive. So it’s kind of a tricky position. Because in my example, and I’ll just give everyone a little bit of background, I grew up always heavy, and I had some stuff going on that I’ll talk about a little bit more in depth, but I was using food as a drug and as a way to cope with my feelings or to not feel them as much. And that can really screw us up. And the problem with the food as the drug is that you still have to eat. So you can’t just go okay, I’m just not going to eat. I’m just going to cut this part out of my life. You have to actually learn how to utilize it in a different way and to not allow it to be that crutch and that escape from reality. When with other things, you can say, okay, I’m just not going to drink alcohol. Obviously, that’s not easy. But you’re not going to ever be in a position where you need it to survive. So with food, that’s why I think we have such an issue as a society. And we can get into all of how easy it is to overdo food. But for me, I was just in such a place mentally that food was my drug. And it led me down this path where I was just morbidly obese and I was at a point where when I’d go to the doctor, first of all, you don’t really like to go to the doctor when you’re in that state because anything that you go for, the first thing they’re going to tell you is you need to lose weight, which I’d say okay, Doc, I’ve got a mirror, I know that.

Neil Dudley: I’m laughing but that is kind of sad. I don’t mean to make light of it because it’s as real as anything. Like being scared to be- It’s not a news flash, you know that. There’s no- nobody needs to point it out. And okay, so we’re going to jump around a little bit because this really segues to a question I have. I really- maybe this is all we talk about; this could be the point of this conversation. What would your advice- I just got to read this because I don’t want to mess it up. What is your advice to others, let’s say me, who want to encourage someone in their life to get healthier, lose weight, and work out? How do I do that? Like, I look in the mirror, I’m pretty happy with what I see from a physical standpoint. How do I approach somebody who I feel I just love them, I want to help them? How do I do that?

Jordan Grahm: That’s a really difficult subject. And I think the most important thing that you can do is, this might sound a little cheesy, but to lead with love. And to do it from a place where you’re not necessarily saying like, hey, you’re bad, or your habits are poor, and they’re leading you down this spiral, because they probably already know that. But what you can do to support people is to say, I love you, and I care about you, and I want you to be around. And that’s I think the biggest thing is that you’re saying like I value you, and I want you to be with us. And this can go I think with other types of addiction issues, too, not just food. It’s that you know and they know that whatever it is is potentially going to shorten their lifespan, just point blank. And we don’t want that for people we love. And just to kind of without saying like, hey, you’re eating too much, hey, your cholesterol is bad, you might get diabetes, all these like risks and things that we know, they already know that. So I think telling people that stuff, reinforcing it is useless. I think that just telling people that you care, and you love them, and you want them to be around and to be healthy and happy, that’s the most important kind of way you can bridge the gap to have those conversations. And realistically, though, sometimes people just don’t want to hear it. And sometimes, you’re not ready. And I know like in my case, my family was, I want to- I’ll use the term, they were on my case to get healthier, to lose the weight, to stop the self destructive pattern. But honestly, it really didn’t matter what they would tell me because I wasn’t ready. And I didn’t have that kind of self love to actually put in the work and to realize that I was worth putting in that effort and making those changes. So it didn’t matter if someone told me, I love you so much, I want you to be around, I want you to have this great, happy and healthy life because I couldn’t see that for myself. And I couldn’t- So it’s almost like you’re just in two different places. And you can’t understand where they’re coming from because it’s like outside of your scope.

Neil Dudley: Sure. Yeah, it’s out- It’s like it’s just not a thing you can picture in your mind, is my imagination. I mean, I feel about half stupid for even talking about it. But I don’t know any other way to get the information out there. I mean, I’m quite possibly going to say something that’s not super sensitive. But it’s not my intention. It’s just I don’t know how else to learn.

Jordan Grahm: Totally, totally. And I think that that’s important to ask those questions because you kind of have to learn by trial and error and learn from those who have been there. And some approaches that work for some people might not work for other people. And that’s something that I’ve found as a coach and as a trainer. Some people need you to kick their ass, and that’s what they want, and that’s what they sign up for. Which is fine. And that works for some people. But some people really need you to be there with them and support them wherever they’re at. And I think- and obviously, there’s tons of space in between. But I think it’s valuable to kind of ask the questions and learn, and sometimes, I’m sure I’ve said stuff to people that I sounded like a total idiot, but I’m learning through that process, and I’m seeing okay, that’s not what- and I need to kind of shift my approach. 

Neil Dudley: Well, and it comes from a genuine place. I think in your particular case, you’ve been there. Like, you’ve got that valid perspective, where I have a harder time- see like, here’s an example, I’m out with my friend who I know needs to get better, and they eat 59 tacos. And I’m thinking on the first one, you really don’t need to eat all those tacos. And it is like, I think it’s more like maybe this is a therapy session for me. Because I think it’s their journey. It’s not my life to live for them. I don’t need to be having all this angst in my own personality and life over what some of their choices are. Although I want something better for them. I really remember that healthy, vibrant human I used to go do things with and just want that back. But we can’t- I mean, we still have to live our journey. We can’t live anybody else’s. Have you experienced anything like that in your coaching, in your own journey? How often were you thinking about quitting? Do you ever still today think I’m going to quit all this, it’s just a pain in the tail?

Jordan Grahm: Right. I’ve seen it all. I’ve been doing this now since 2011. So 11 years of being a personal trainer and coach, remote, online, and in person. And I’ve found, obviously, I can’t want it for someone more than they want it for themselves. And it’s hard sometimes because that’s where we’re at. Sometimes people just, they say they are motivated change, but the pain that is associated with those changes is too great for them. They want to stay in the comfort of doing what they’ve been doing, although that has its own set of pain.

Neil Dudley: Pick your pain I’ve heard it said.

Jordan Grahm: Right, it’s going to be hard either way. Like, it’s going to be hard to be in an unhealthy lifestyle and body because it has its own ramifications, which I’ve lived. I mean, I broke the seat of my car, and the service guy was like, I’ve never seen this before. 

Neil Dudley: I got to imagine when you’re carrying around that much extra weight, I mean, you lost 200 pounds. That’s me. That is me. I’m 200 pounds. You lost that much weight from your body. So you’re just carrying me around 24/7. I know that has to be painful. Now you’ve been a coach for 11 years, right? So when did you start, I guess I want to say healing? Or when did you start kind of getting better or choosing to lose some weight and think about your health differently?

Jordan Grahm: Yeah, that’s a great question. I’ll back it up a little bit. I was always overweight, as far back as I remember, as a little kid. And by the time I was 13, I was 290 pounds, and five foot nine. I was a big kid at 13. And so I played football in high school. It’s not as big of a deal here as it is out there. It’s funny, I didn’t know any of the rules and they just put me on the field. Because I never watched football, nothing.

Neil Dudley: Wow. You’re big enough, you can get in the way.

Jordan Grahm: Exactly. And they said just get bigger, get stronger, get faster, you’ll figure it all out as you go. So I was big. And then I kept getting bigger. And when I was 14, my mom passed away suddenly. And that really just sent me into a really bad depression. It was just out of nowhere. And it still troubles me, obviously, it’s one of the most important people in our lives is our mom, our parents. And as a 14-year-old, I did not have any capacity to deal with that. And so, my go-to was food. And so I just kept eating and eating. And by the time I graduated high school, I was 17, and I was over 400 pounds. And I just kept getting worse. I kept eating. And I knew that this was a method of slowly killing myself. 

Neil Dudley: You were cognizant of that. 

Jordan Grahm: Yeah. And I accepted that. And I said, okay, then this is how it’s going to be. I’m going to just going to live an unhealthy life. It’s probably going to be cut short because of my decisions. And that’s okay with me. And that’s just kind of the path I was on. For anyone who’s lived through anything like that, it’s really a dark and terrible place. It really is. And when you’re in it, it’s hard to see how bad it is until you kind of get out of it and you go, whoa, that was-

Neil Dudley: Yeah, when you’re in it, it is just normal. You don’t even know it’s dark. It’s just your life.

Jordan Grahm: Right. That’s like the status quo. I’m like that’s just how it’s going to be. And I didn’t plan for the future, like having a family or having a life. And in 2008, I was on my way home, I got hit head on by a drunk driver. And my airbag in the car had just been reconnected a couple hours before this crash. So it was disconnected for a week. And then my buddy reconnected it and reset the thing with his computer. And off I went and got hit. And it came out and it saved me. And I’m like, okay, that’s a sign. I’m not the most spiritual person, but that’s my mom looking out for me. And that’s her telling me like, hey, get your act together. You can’t keep living like that.

Neil Dudley: I can’t reconnect the airbag forever.

Jordan Grahm: Right, exactly. And I realized that night, I’m like this is not how she wanted me to live. She would not want me to live a miserable existence where I’m just counting the days until I have a heart attack and drop dead. And that’s what was happening. So, from that night, I just decided I had to turn everything around, complete 180. And I had no knowledge, no experience. But I decided that I’m going to just start walking my dog, not either of these dogs, my dog is no longer with us, an hour a day. 

Neil Dudley: Oh man, doesn’t that dog hold a special place in your life?

Jordan Grahm: Oh yeah. That dog, I mean, she saved me, really. 

Neil Dudley: It’s so beautiful to me how every story can be so unique, yet so similar to other- like, yours just happened to be this crazy circumstance of the car wreck. And then I’m going to walk my dog. And that gave you kind of a purpose. It kind of also let you have a partner in this journey. 

Jordan Grahm: Right. And that’s someone to help me stay accountable. Because when I- I walked the next day. So I had a broken wrist from the car accident, and my arm was in a sling, separated shoulder. And I’m like I’m taking the dog. And I always tell people, put your treadmill at 1.0 because that was all I could do, one mile an hour. And it took us an hour and we walked a mile down the hill where we live and then back up home. And I was demolished. I mean, just having been in a car crash and being that heavy, not conditioned to doing it. But I told myself, okay, I’m going to do it every day. And the dog is like, yeah, let’s- the dog will do it 10 times. And I also realized, okay, that’s my activity. But I also have to do 180 degree turn with my food and my relationship with food. So I am no longer going to allow myself to even go into the drive thru. I mean, I was programmed. I would come out of class or out of my job and the car is just on autopilot right into Carl’s Jr or whatever. And I just said, okay, that’s it, I’m just not going to go there. I just cannot. Because I know if I go in there, it’s going to go into my same pattern, where I’m going to order, and keep in mind, this is 2008, $20 worth of dollar menu food and eat it. Those two big kind of major changes where I said, okay, I’m going to start trying to eat healthier, which that means that I’m going to actually include like vegetables that aren’t just the one sheet of lettuce in the burger and include lean proteins and fruits and things that are not just came out of a box. 

Neil Dudley: I like stuff that will go bad if you don’t eat it in the next five days. I think of food as it should be perishable. Now, we smoke our bacon and we do some different things that gives it some shelf life beyond 7 or 10 days when it’s just raw. But like I promise- I mean, didn’t somebody do a study on a McDonald’s burger? Like they bought it, just set it in the fridge and it stayed good for 10 years or something. I mean, it was kind of crazy,

Jordan Grahm:  Right. It’s not going to change. you don’t want that in your body. 

Neil Dudley: Okay, real quick, I got to ask a couple of things. Do you have any siblings? And is your family obese? I mean, is this a- So did you see people in your family with the same size issue I guess we’ll call it?

Jordan Grahm: Right. I have an older brother, and he is not heavy at all. He’s just probably 130 pounds of a guy. And my parents were not heavy. Nobody in my family was. It was really just me. Which actually made it even weirder because then you’re really like the odd man out.

Neil Dudley: Yeah, sure. And they’re probably, maybe not intentionally, but just in reality, not understanding how you’re feeling. I’m sure you got bullied. I’m sure- like there’s so much that comes with being overweight. And then in our country now, we are trying to normalize obesity in some ways, which I think is a real topic of conversation that we should all be having. I’m not sure it’s a good idea to normalize it. But I am sure that bullying people for those things is not great, either. So it’s like this kind of double edged sword we got to figure out.

Jordan Grahm: Right. And that was my family, they meant the best for me, but they didn’t understand it because they weren’t going through that experience. They didn’t know how it felt to be bullied because you’re the big guy, and you’re a big and easy target. I mean, kids want to find someone who’s different.

Neil Dudley: And then I think you as a human are just kind of a nice guy. Like, I mean, it’s just you have a big heart. You just come across as even super humble, maybe a little quiet and shy like naturally. So you are such an example of going and doing those things that make you uncomfortable and then staying with it day after day. How did you think about it when you were initially out there? Were you thinking about it like 10 years from now, I’m going to be in some kind of position, or were you just kind of biting it off a day at a time?

Jordan Grahm: It was really one day at a time. And I think that’s what really got me the best results is not looking at- I never thought to myself, okay, I have 200 pounds to lose. I mean, I knew it deep down, of course, because when you’re- but I just said, okay, I have to just keep getting better. I have to just keep staying consistent, keep doing my walks, keep spending my hour a day on my physical activity, keep learning about food because I knew nothing, so I just had to learn as I went. And that is I think what really made the biggest difference in allowing me to end up losing over 200 pounds and totally shifting my entire body composition and like abilities. I would see things and oh yeah, that’s not for me, like doing a pull up, that’s crazy. I’ll never do that. Until I was like, you know what, I want to try that, and I’m going to go in that direction. And I think taking it one day at a time and setting like small, more digestible goals, especially when we’ve got- and I’ve now helped a lot of people who’ve lost like half their body weight, and really, which is super impressive, but I really try to kind of frame it as that like that’s the big picture, sure, but let’s look at the individual steps. Every day, what can we do to push us a little bit closer. And those are the people who one or two years down the line, however long it takes, they get the result and then they are able to hold on to it. That’s another thing, losing a lot of weight is super difficult and it’s impressive. But then keeping the lifestyle going and maintaining it and not getting complacent and going back, that’s a whole nother animal.

Neil Dudley: Yeah, sure. That’s even- that’s the tenacity I’m talking about I see in you. It is that come hell or high water, I’m not going to fail on this thing. Now, in your life, where did you come up with that skill set? Like, did you just have to grab it out of thin air? Did you have a mentor? Was it your mom? Who kind of- I think it’s so hard to have that. And if you just built it for yourself, I think that’d be a huge thing. If it’s the truth that somebody mentored you to it. I’m so curious. Where did you come up with that?

Jordan Grahm: I mean, honestly, I would say my parents definitely influenced me in that my dad and my mom, they’re both hard workers and would like see through whatever they set their minds to. But during that process, I was kind of on my own. And it sounds crazy, but my dog, that dog, speaking of tenacity, I mean, these ones are, these are potatoes over here, but she was a Boston Terrier. And that dog, I mean, you could play with that dog till she cannot physically move, and then she’d keep playing. She’d throw the ball again. And it kind of- I remember I would take her for these walks, and one time I decided, and I was still about 300 and something pounds, I’m like today, we’re going to do 10 miles, which was insane to me, because we were usually doing 4. And so we went for four, our usual, then I did another one. Then I went inside, got some water, had a snack, and came back out with the dog to keep going. And we finally got through the tenth mile. And I was like, I’m done. This is- and I literally remember as soon as I came back inside, I go to sit down. She brings me a ball, like let’s go. I’m like, okay, we always have a little bit more.

Neil Dudley: I mean, that’s so true. You always have one more step. Like, I mean, it’s so- I’ve just been there in different ways. Like, even with just getting up to go workout. There are days I just don’t want to do it. I’m just like laying there making up a million excuses why shouldn’t, why I don’t have to, I’m just fine. You have to find that skill, that tenacity to say, I expect more from myself than this and just one, two, three, roll out of bed and go because it’s so easy to talk yourself out of it. Like on that 10 mile day, when you went in to eat and get a drink, I can’t believe you came back out.

Jordan Grahm: I strongly considered- I remember actually called some buddies, and I was like, hey, because I lived on this hill, I’m like you might have to be on standby to come pick the dog and I up. I didn’t have to do that. And I think it’s like what you said, sometimes you just made this promise to yourself. Nobody else is looking. Nobody else is watching. Nobody else cares. Which is actually a freeing thing because it’s the commitment that we make to ourselves. Like, I committed that I’m going to get my butt up and walk every day. So, we’re in Los Angeles, the weather’s pretty much on our side, but some days it would rain. And there’s that little side of me, oh, it’s raining, you can slip. The dog doesn’t want to be out there. Don’t do it today. Of course, I was out there in the rain. And you know what, I slipped and I ate it a few times in the rain. And I’m like that’s part of the deal. I’ve made this commitment. I remember one time I was holding my phone, using it as a boombox. I just ate it and shattered ever- And I’m like, no one saw, cool, get the dog, keep going. And when you make up your mind, and you make that commitment to yourself, it’s like when you get up and you’re just like I really don’t want to go do any exercises because the bed is comfortable. I got stuff to do. I got- but you’re like, hey, if you just do it before you start overthinking it, start talking yourself out it, it goes such a long way. And then you feel so much better.  

Neil Dudley: I don’t know, for me, the hard- like those hard mornings of getting up, after that workout is such a good feeling. I mean, I hope other people get that because like I can hold on to that because I can say I know if I go do this, I’m going to get that great feeling after the workout, after I sweat. After I’ve just kind of got out of bed and drove up to the gym, I’m not going to not do it then. I mean, like, by then I’ve got to do it. And some days I kill it. Some days, I’m kind of half ass it. But I’m still at the gym. I’m still going. And at the end of that, I just feel so good.

Jordan Grahm: Yeah, you’ve honored that commitment to yourself. And even the days, I always say, and this is a popular thing, like even a kind of crappy workout is going to be better than nothing. There’s some days you go in, you do one thing. But that’s one more than you would have done if you just stayed at home. There are some days you go in and do all the things and you’re like, hey, I got more in me and you do more. I think that’s kind of a cool way to look at it. And this older gentleman who was a power lifter and stuff taught me this thing that I use for myself and for my clients that is you got to train the body that you walked in with this day. You can’t compare it to where you were yesterday, where you want to be tomorrow. What you walked in with, train that body, and sometimes it can do a lot more than you think it could. Sometimes it could be less. I’ve gotten under a weight one day and just, I go to unrack it on a squat, like, no, put it back, I’m going to go do something else.

Neil Dudley: And then don’t beat yourself up about that. Like, I think you can get that bad mental tape recorder of- you’re just- Why are you pussing out? You should do it. Well, you got to find all of those things. And this is me and Jordan saying what we think. Your truth will be a little different. It’s going to be in this same vein, but it might be a little different.

Jordan Grahm: And I think you learn a lot about yourself in that process. I mean, I didn’t know I had all this in me when I started. And I didn’t know what I was capable of. Now, not to toot my own horn, but I’ve done half marathons and competed in bodybuilding, powerlifting. I had cancer, and I got rid of that. I don’t think that was necessarily through training, that was more the doctors here.

Neil Dudley: But you had to wake up every day and stay fit and not let that derail your other progress. That’s the other crazy thing about life. There’s a stress in every closet. There’s a stress around every corner, whether it’s financial, relational, spiritual, any of- just it is true for me. Like, I go workout and then that’s basically a 12 hour kind of free high for me because that blood pumping, it just really does something for my body. I go take a cold shower. I can handle stress better after that. But I’ll still, come lunchtime, I do kind of- I have to really be careful about taking that meal as something other than nutrition. I can want it to be soothing to me more than nutritional to me, so I have to watch that.

Jordan Grahm: And you’re aware of it. That takes- it just takes practice. And people are, I think sometimes, and this goes for myself, we’re afraid to fail, and we’re afraid to maybe do it the wrong way so much that we don’t even try, or we don’t try to make any changes because oh well, I’m so used to doing it this way. And what if I’m trying really hard and I have a bad day where I go and I find myself back in the drive thru and eating some stuff that I know doesn’t – 

Neil Dudley: Did ever happen to you?

Jordan Grahm: You know, it was- not really. I was pretty-

Neil Dudley: I mean, that’s a big question to ask too. Because that’s- you have to admit some things. I would say somebody with an addiction, let’s say a substance abuse problem, I don’t think they’re held to this perfection standard. Maybe it didn’t happen for you. Maybe you never found yourself back in the drive thru. But if you had, it wasn’t- it doesn’t diminish you now or ever. It was just, man, I stubbed my toe. Don’t let that now then ruin everything. Just go on to another good day. 

Jordan Grahm: Right, right. And let me back up –definitely not saying that I’ve been perfect or am perfect. It was just actually the physical drive thru, I’ve really tried to keep myself- that doesn’t mean I haven’t gone and ordered or delivered foods that I know don’t necessarily align with my big picture. And to be honest, when I got this diagnosis, you can see I got a little scar here, of thyroid cancer, I remember that first week I was so bummed and I did find myself eating some stuff that I wouldn’t normally eat. I had a bunch of what we’d call a California burrito. I don’t know if you’ve ever had those. It’s a burrito with carne asada, so good steak, avocado, cheese, sour cream, and french fries wrapped up. I mean, it’s delicious, but a ton of calories. And so I remember that week when I got that news and they are like, yeah it’s cancer, I’m like, I found myself ordering a couple of those. And eventually I’m like, hey, snap out of it, that’s not going to help you. You get that temporary satisfaction of yeah, it tastes really good, but it’s not doing anything good for me. And I’m the kind of person that I’m like, okay, I’m actually going to turn this around, and I’m going to treat my upcoming surgery for this cancer thing like it’s a competition, and I’m going to just get in the best possible shape. So when I get on the table, when they go to cut me up or whatever, I’m like in the most optimal position to have a good recovery and to be in the best- I want my resting heart rate down. And I did it. But like you said, you stub your toe, we all do, and it’s natural, and it’s a human thing.

Neil Dudley: Somebody said, we all- I mean, we’ve not even said anything that’s life shattering news. There’s no invention that Jordan and I have just came up with. But every bit of it requires execution. Like so knowing what to do, big whoop dee doo, you probably already do. I know I do. It’s about executing on that knowledge every day.

Jordan Grahm: And I think people, we want to make it more difficult and complicated than it really is. Like, we know if we get up and we move our bodies, whatever that looks like, you go for a walk, whatever type of workout, if you like Zumba, swim, whatever it is, you move your body, you get those endorphins and blood flow, that sets you up for a much better rest of your day. And when you eat in a way that’s nourishing to your body and not just like whatever’s convenient and tastes good only, you feel better.

Neil Dudley: All right, let’s talk about something real quick. I’m just thinking, man, this conversation has flown by. We’ve already been talking for like 35 minutes. And I got to ask you about Food Fact Friday and what you’re seeing in the world. I’ve had people that are big advocates for the carnivore diet on the show. I’m not sure that you’re a big advocate for it. And I want your perspective to be available to our listeners. I’ve ate carnivore. I’ve ate Keto. I’ve done everything but vegan or vegetarian. Like I’ve just never- I guess I’ve never gotten that serious about it to- or I’ve never found the value in me experiencing that. Although that doesn’t mean it’s not there. So tell me what you think about eating fruits and vegetables, the carnivore diet, veganism, vegetarians. What is your thoughts?

Jordan Grahm: Yeah, so I mean, look, and I will preface this with I’ve definitely tried keto myself, especially when I had the cancer situation because there was some information out that it is helpful with reducing the size and potentially improving odds of remission with cancer. So I gave that like a full whirl. And it was fine. With the keto, like the way I did it, I was able to still eat vegetables like greens. So I do think that’s important just for fiber. 

Neil Dudley: Oh, yeah, I think as part of keto, that’s- if you’re just doing- if you’re trying to get your body into ketosis, and you’re trying to stay away from carbs and sugar and some of those things, vegetables are not disallowed.

Jordan Grahm: And I think they can be helpful. And this is the thing, like everyone’s different. Some people might really feel good with just eating meat and animal products only, like a carnivore. As far as I understand the actual carnivore thing, you don’t have anything that’s plant based, it’s just like meat, dairy I believe.

Neil Dudley: Almost only red meat and eggs and something like that. 

Jordan Grahm: Which for some folks, they might feel great, and it might improve their health. 

Neil Dudley: But it does seem extreme. It does seem extreme. To anybody, that seems extreme. Same as vegan seems super extreme.

Jordan Grahm: Exactly. And I think, my personal philosophy just going through my own transformation, I did go back to school and study nutrition and I’ve been certified with all these nutrition certifications. And I think anything extreme is not necessarily the best approach for long term. It might be a good kind of short term intervention to kind of get people going and get you moving in the right direction and kind of understanding a little bit more about how your body deals without having the things that- the carnivore diet tells you not to have certain things, a vegan diet or vegetarians don’t eat these things. But I think a well rounded approach, where you see how you feel when you include some of them, is probably what I think is the easiest to stick to long term and gives people the best results. So you mentioned the Food Facts Friday, I’ve been doing these little things on my Instagram. And I was up in the citrus capital of California, and it reminded me that I had heard about folks who were actually getting scurvy, which was not something that we would see in kind of a modern society, because they were just eating this carnivore way that did not allow them to get the vitamin C that they needed to prevent getting scurvy. So, I kind of made a little tongue in cheek thing of like, don’t- you’re not a pirate, you don’t need to be getting yourself scurvy. But when you think about it, it’s like, okay, there might be a reason that incorporating some oranges, even if you’re doing carnivore, and you’re like committed to that, it can be helpful because I’ve looked at the effects of scurvy. It does not sound fun. And I think that kind of- it’s like you said, these extreme kind of methodologies, they might have some downsides. They might have some things where it’s like, okay, your body actually does need- I personally believe that most people could do better with eating more fiber, just in general, not necessarily, you’d don’t have to eat the- like fiber fortified foods, I don’t think is that great anyway, but fruits and vegetables and whole grains, legumes, things that like kind of make things work better. They help with blood cholesterol levels and things like that. So, I think just kind of a well rounded approach, in my experience, works. But I’ve got buddies who are full on carnivore, full on keto, full on vegan, vegetarian, everything in between, and they’ll swear up and down, this is the way. And whatever makes people feel good. But if it’s someone who comes to me and wants help or advice, I typically try to get them to understand that extreme is not sustainable. And if you want to do this for a long term, you want to do something that you sustain, now, if you’re telling me that you just love eating delicious steaks, and you want to be able to do that every day, by all means you should. I think that’s great. I just think that maybe you should also include some fruits and veggies and things that kind of will help balance it up. You can get a ton of good nutrition from animal products. But I do think that you need to, not need, but it would behoove- 

Neil Dudley: Well, and that’s what’s crazy about our world these days. Everybody wants to say,  take this dead stance, really hardline stance about things. I’m not sure that benefits us either. I mean, I think there are people called to really drive a thing forward, let’s call it carnivore, because there is some use in that for someone somewhere, and I don’t know every case of that. Same thing with vegan. Same thing with keto, a lot of these other options. Are you familiar with Whole 30? Have you ever heard of the Whole 30 reset? What do you think about that?

Jordan Grahm: I think some of the- again, I think some of it is really good because I think it focuses on having people eat whole foods, which that’s something that I think really most people can benefit from tremendously. There’s a few things that I’ve seen in there that I wasn’t super fond of that- And it’s again, more of just like things that you’re restricted from that, in my opinion, don’t necessarily have merit. But I do think that basing most of our consumption on whole foods is a really good idea. I think that’s what most people- And if it takes, let’s say, a 30 day challenge, where you’re narrowed to just this list to get you in that direction, I think that’s fantastic. Now, if you then go, well, I can’t believe that person. They must not care about their health because they’re not eating Whole 30 or they’re- that’s obviously its own issue. But I do think that there’s some merit to kind of like a jumpstart, like kind of just getting yourself going a little bit more and learning. Because I think most of the time if someone’s doing something like that, they’re motivated to change, and they want to make that change of like, okay, I want to focus on not eating so much processed stuff. There’s got to be a reason.

Neil Dudley: Yeah, sure. I am a person that needs that kind of real strict outline. I’ve done this thing called the 75 Hard, which is 75 days of kind of two workouts. And people, trainers specifically, look at me like I’m a little crazy, like maybe I’m weak minded. And that could be true. Like, I’m weak minded in the way that I can’t take the middle. Like, I need- I got to be 100% in or I’m not very- I’ll be out. But that’s me. That’s not you. That’s not maybe the next person.

Jordan Grahm: Right. Well, and I wouldn’t necessarily classify that as weak minded. I would just say that’s how your mind likes to target things and go, okay, like if I have- two workouts a day, one is outside, you’ve got to read 10 pages of a nonfiction book, a gallon of water. There’s like some pretty strict stipulations. And then I remember the one thing, and this is what like the trainer- if you screw up one day, you start back at the top, you start 35 days. And for some people, I think, to kickstart those habits, that’s probably really helpful and it probably- I’ve seen, you see people who they had no structure before, and then they take on something like that, and that doesn’t mean they’re always doing all of it after the 75 days, but what they absorbed from it, the habits that you might have picked up doing that, are probably staying with you.

Neil Dudley: Well, I mean, the one thing I took away from it that I really am proud of is don’t tell me I can’t do it because by gosh, I will. I will and I can. And I failed in there, like I forgot to take a progress picture. So I started over. I mean, I was like these are the rules. I’m going to do it. Now, by the time I got to 75 days, I was tired. I mean, I was physically tired, mentally tired, my family was missing me. There was a lot of stuff, like the family had to be on board to do that. So I really softened my stance a bit towards the end. And I said, okay, so I’m just going to redo the days that I messed up and I ended up doing maybe 80 total days or something. But I still- like by then, I had had the growth I needed, which was I totally can do anything that I put my mind to. Anything. I have no doubt in that. That’s a cool feeling.

Jordan Grahm: Oh, yeah, I mean, I would say that’s probably more valuable than the physical and then all of- and not that- I mean, the work is hard, right? It’s called 75 Hard. And the work that- with anything, it’s not easy to-

Neil Dudley: You have the same thing from your journey. I mean, I promise, there’s not- I don’t think I could come up with something that you decided you wanted to do and you wouldn’t have the confidence you could do it. Because like you’ve took on really a big challenge.

Jordan Grahm: Yeah, yeah. And I think that building that and proving it to yourself is really, like you said, it’s like you set out to do it, you have the rules. And even if you stumble a little bit, you made up for it and you did it. Okay, like whatever else gets thrown at me or that I choose to bring upon myself, I know I can do it. I made it through that. Yeah. And I think that is really the coolest part about all of this work that we’re in in this world is that like you show yourself what you’re made of. And most of the time, we don’t even know. I mean, I had no idea, no clue. 

Neil Dudley: The takeaway is, it’s your journey, you got to go get it for yourself. Nobody’s going to do it for you, nor are they going to care that much. Like you have to go get this thing for yourself. And Jordan, I so appreciate you as somebody I can look up to and say, man, that guy inspires me. Everybody, if you’re listening, I thank you so much for your time. Like your time is your most valuable asset. You’ve spent this time with Jordan and I listening to us just have a conversation around some topics that we’re passionate about. Thank you for being here. Go follow Jordan at thefitboss on Instagram. And we’ll put links to all of his other places, his website where you can go get some coaching if you want. I mean, I’ll bet you money this guy can coach you well, if that’s something you want, if you want to commit to that. But I would be scared to say I want it and then not really want it. I got to feeling he’ll put you through the wringer.

Jordan Grahm: I do my best. I got my assistants here. So if I don’t do it-

Neil Dudley: Anyways, this has been a blast for me. I’m super excited to share this with the Pederson’s Farms family, the PNFers out there who pay attention to what we’re doing. And it really does, it is still paints another picture of where food comes from and why it’s important and those things. So is there anything you’d like to make sure the audience hears that we might not have talked about yet?

Jordan Grahm: I mean, I want to thank you again and your wonderful audience. I think this is so important. And I’m just really, really glad that you and I connected, and I hope that I get to see you when you’re in LA. We’re going to make that happen. 

Neil Dudley: That’s the Fit Expo LA. Everybody, get your tickets, come out there. I’ll be speaking. Jordan will be around. I don’t know, are you speaking too? Do you have a- 

Jordan Grahm: I should be.

Neil Dudley: So there you go. You can come see us get on the stage and tell you all about all the great things that we know, which I’m being a little sarcastic there because you probably already know it. We’re just going to encourage you to dig it up out of yourself and deploy it, execute on that knowledge.

Jordan Grahm: Exactly. Yeah, I really appreciate it. I’m actually going to go cook some of the Pederson’s bison right now. That stuff is fantastic. And I’ll make sure they don’t steal it. And thank you so much, Neil. I really appreciate it. 

Neil Dudley: Oh, man, it’s great. It’s great. Everybody, come back next time. We’ll talk to another really industry thought leader that you can learn from. So don’t leave the Pederson’s Farms family, keep coming back to these episodes. I know you’ll find valuable insights. Thank you for being here. 

Hey, everybody. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of the Pederson’s Farms Podcast. It’s been a blast bringing this to you. And I sure hope you enjoyed it and found value. If you did, tell a friend, share it out on social media, hit that subscribe button, or go check us out at pedersonsfarms.com. We sure hope you do. Thanks for being here.